Looking for Workflow tips...

I just spent most of the past 72 hours working on making something for the challenge, which has been great, that amount of time has gotten me much more familiar with the BM3 and helped me to figure out a lot of workflow systems. On the flip side, that focused time has also given me a better understanding where I’m feeling clumsy and looking for whatever feedback people have.

Probably the first issue is not necessarily an app thing as much as an iOS thing - data entry. I find that I am often accidentally making notes when I meant to scroll, or when I meant to delete a different note, or that I drop patterns in at the wrong spot, then when I go to put it correct I overshoot my target back and forth repeatedly, same with loop points etc. It feels a bit clumsy to always be zooming in and out and changing grid resolution back and forth all the time… Curious if people have methods that have helped with their workflow in this regard. I have started using a 53 stylus (like an apple pencil but cheaper) and that helps a bit, but I’m open to advice…

Next - patterns. Curious how people compose their patterns in the organizational sense… I find that to keep up the pace I tend to work mostly in pattern 01 - then copy it by hitting ’duplicate’ when I like it, which saves the new pattern elsewhere, clear the one I was last working on, then repeat that process until I have enough variations. Next I go back and rename all the patterns I want to keep and place them on the time line. What other systems are people using?

Scene mode… I didn’t find myself using this - how are people using scene mode? I know a lot of step sequencers have something similar, so there must be common uses for it… I see the live application, but I wonder if there is a way to use it compositionally I hadn't considered.

Track Automation - OMG!! So frustrating… I can’t seem to draw ramps or new points in a ramp without making / deleting / moving other points that I don’t want to mess with. And how do we do curves? Are steps possible? (without making lotsa points)? Also, if you don’t have automation or reset data in each pattern it will use the last patterns value - so should I make pattern templates with zero’d out automation, or is there an easier way?

And choking loop tails when moving between patterns - is making a ‘ghost’ loop in the the choke group the best way to do that, or is there a simpler way?

Mainly I'd just like to here if people had ideas, none of these things are deal breakers or anything. All in all, this is super fun, mostly I'm genuinely curious about peoples techniques.

Cheers.

Comments

  • edited April 2018

    Regarding your first question...

    When editing patterns I usually default to the select mode so my clumsy fingers don't keep drawing extra random notes. Most of the edits I do are adjusting timing and pitch of existing notes, or selecting/removing multiple notes, but if I need to draw in a few more I switch to paint mode, draw them in, and then switch back to select mode

    I can share some tips on the other things when I have time later this evening.

    This could turn into a really useful thread.

  • edited April 2018

    When editing patterns I usually default to the select mode so my clumsy fingers don't keep drawing extra random notes. Most of the edits I do are adjusting timing and pitch of existing notes, or selecting/removing multiple notes, but if I need to draw in a few more I switch to paint mode, draw them in, and then switch back to select mode

    Cool - so you do most of your stuff as live record then? I ran into the issue of - dropping a blank pattern onto the timeline, hitting record, tapping my idea out on the pads - and finding that bm made another pattern on top of the one on the timeline, I haven't quite figured out when it does that vs recording into the blank one.

    I guess that could be a good use for scene mode, to more or less improvise until you get it close, then drop it onto the timeline and edit as necessary. I do like to live record, but mostly to get a rough idea going then flesh it out in the editor.

    Its frustrating that whenever I am moving things around, iOS seems to always move stuff a smidge as I lift my finger. I wonder if that could somehow be addressed.

    Not to get too existential with it, but lately I'm all about finding new ways to create, examine, alter, organize, store and recall patterns. I often wonder if a person is much more than the patterns they emit, hell, even DNA is just a really elegant pattern. And music = waveforms = pattern.

    To bring it back to this forum - hoping to find intuitive ways to work with midi data.

  • edited April 2018

    Generally, I set my loop markers in Song view, enable/arm record on the relevant track(s), then let BM3 automatically create new patterns as I bang away on the pads/keyboard etc..

    If I ever end up with overlaid patterns (which still happens sometimes) I group select them and use the 'merge' command

    NB - I never use Scenes

  • edited April 2018

    @scottsunn Start using scenes. It will improve your workflow to no end. It’s a fast way of getting an idea down and then creating an entire song arrangement out of your initial groove. You then copy the different sections of your arrangement into song mode. It’s revolutionised my work flow. Where as before I would be stuck with 4 bar grooves, i now finish entire song arrangements all because of scenes. It’s so fast.

  • edited April 2018

    Its frustrating that whenever I am moving things around, iOS seems to always move stuff a smidge as I lift my finger. I wonder if that could somehow be addressed.

    Nanostudio had an ingenious solution for this. Instead of dragging the little notes around directly you were given handles on the bottom/side of the editor that enabled you the slide them up/down and left/right without your big clumsy fingers obscuring your view

    Note - the left Time handle was for position, the right Time handle was for note length

    Still today, this is probably my favourite implementation of touchscreen midi editing. Cubasis would be my second choice.

  • Note entry is the main reason i cant switch to Beatmaker as my main composition software.

    The second reason i cant switch is drawing automation.

    You are not alone, those two things have been enough to have me physically shouting at first myself thinking im too stupid or clumsy, then the iPad, then just giving up on a very regular basis.

    I agree with @tk32 nanostudio and Cubasis tower over Beatmakerfor note entry.
    We were promisedthey would revisit this horribilness, i will remind @mathieugarcia.

  • Yeah... Editing automation data really sucks currently. It's usually quicker to delete and do again live.

  • @tk32 said:

    Its frustrating that whenever I am moving things around, iOS seems to always move stuff a smidge as I lift my finger. I wonder if that could somehow be addressed.

    Nanostudio had an ingenious solution for this. Instead of dragging the little notes around directly you were given handles on the bottom/side of the editor that enabled you the slide them up/down and left/right without your big clumsy fingers obscuring your view

    Note - the left Time handle was for position, the right Time handle was for note length

    Still today, this is probably my favourite implementation of touchscreen midi editing. Cubasis would be my second choice.

    Mmmm... can you move notes with those lines around them too?

  • edited April 2018

    My favourite 2 apps for music production are BeatMaker and Caustic. I have experience with hardware sequencers like the RM1x, RS7000 and MPC500.. And have used conrollers like Maschine and Push. I’m quite critical when it comes to workflow..

    I love BeatMaker as it feels like a more direct Maschine.. I can program beats like it’s hardware… The workflow is great.. I love the clips and scenes, that flexibiity reminds me of Ableton.. I’m sure Intua will improve the app so it’s more stable, bug free and streamlined when it comes to workflow. I believe this will be the nr 1 DAW on iOS.

    **Workflow wise Caustic is superior.. **that app is so well designed. It’s very cpu efficient and I haven’t noticed any bugs so far.. Also, it offers so many machines.. a supersaw synth, bassline synth, multisample sampler that plays sf2 files, vocoder, etc etc. etc. I also like the GUI of v 3.2.0 a lot.. But the workflow… is sooo fast.

    Check this video about note selection and changing the note length:

    Automation:

    So If you’re looking for another app to use alongside BeatMaker.. check out Caustic. If you want to hear what it’s capable of, checkout these guys.. They are true Caustic Jedi Masters!

    • Maximus Marte

    • Ariix

  • hey, my comment is gone?

  • edited April 2018

    Here's a weird tip I've seen other producer use in the desktop daw world that I quite like using: tap out the rhythm first. In other words, using the pads or keys, record in your melody rhythm on the root note. Then go into the pianoroll and move the notes around rather than draw them in. It feels easier in that it takes some of the mental agony of looking at all the lines and trying to guess or calculate where your next note needs to be drawn and its duration. It just comes down to a matter of counting semitones and octaves. For chords simply copy your notes. As far as automation goes I just record it and try to keep the flow going. I'll work on final adjustments in the finishing stages.

  • @SlowwFloww said:
    hey, my comment is gone?

    What comment ?
    The Caustic stuff is all there.

  • edited April 2018

    you're right.. :)

    After putting my love for BeatMaker in bold type I tought the comment dissapeared...

  • edited April 2018

    Going back to OP's question(s)...

    PATTERNS:
    Ernest Hemingway famously said* you should "write drunk; edit sober" (figuratively, not literally!), and this is roughly the philosophy I take when starting new songs with in BM3. As mentioned before, I start with tequila arming the relevant tracks in song mode and then let BM3 create new patterns as and when they are needed whilst I'm jamming on the pads/keys in loop record.
    I rarely, if ever, name patterns, and I hardly ever delete the unused ones. Instead I just identify the ones on the timeline that are good, and then repeat them, or duplicate if I want to make a variation.

    If you ever looked at one of my tracks, you would find a ton of unused and unnamed patterns in every bank. I keep meaning to organise and tidy up. I imagine all the different naming conventions I could use to name the patterns. But... invariably... life's too short, and it doesn't matter a bit that it's a mess. I know what's good because it's already out there on my timeline.


    *technically, this quote might be from Peter De Vries instead of EH, as he once wrote: "Sometimes I write drunk and revise sober, and sometimes I write sober and revise drunk. But you have to have both elements in creation — the Apollonian and the Dionysian, or spontaneity and restraint, emotion and discipline."

  • ^I've started adopting some of this in my workflow. It’s definitely faster and easier to record things and then edit later, and I’m also starting to deal with my “good” patterns on the timeline too, but that could make it more of a chore to copy a pattern from one bank to another, but not too much. I’ve always enjoyed writing/editing drunk/sober and switching that up sometimes.

    I’ve also definitely tapped out the rhythm of notes and then adjusted the note pitch later as @LucidMusicInc mentioned =)

  • @tk32 said:

    If I ever end up with overlaid patterns (which still happens sometimes) I group select them and use the 'merge' command

    Nice - I give the merge command a go next time...

    NB - I never use Scenes

    I might give scene mode a better go too...

    Thanks for the feedback, I'll post if I have any epiphanies with this subject.

  • @tk32 said:
    Going back to OP's question(s)...

    PATTERNS:
    I start with tequila

    Best advice yet...

  • @5pinlink said:
    Note entry is the main reason i cant switch to Beatmaker as my main composition software.

    The second reason i cant switch is drawing automation.

    You are not alone, those two things have been enough to have me physically shouting at first myself thinking im too stupid or clumsy, then the iPad, then just giving up on a very regular basis.

    I agree with @tk32 nanostudio and Cubasis tower over Beatmakerfor note entry.
    We were promisedthey would revisit this horribilness, i will remind @mathieugarcia.

    Seems like it would be an easy fix... but I also sympathize with software designers in that it will never be finished, so you have to pick your battles.

    I think having a D pad type system would be really solid and not too difficult to create... I mentioned it in another post, and I'm sure its been discussed already - if not already addressed in BM2... but in case @mathieugarcia reads this:

    Just add a few more editing tools down by the other tools. Note tool, grid tool etc... Controlled by a D pad with maybe an action button or two in the middle... Like 'draw note' 'copy' 'paste' 'delete' etc. And 'shot' tool that pours you a shot of tequila, backrub tool... Lastly the 'poops money' tool, no DAW is complete without that.

    With the poops money tool maybe @mathieugarcia could finally retire...

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