Why so unintuitive?

I understand the concept of being flexible and feature rich but I feel a lot of Beatmaker 3 is just unintuitive and needlessly complex. Initially I found myself having to do extra tasks just to get it to work on a basic level. Like just entering in a simple pattern and getting it to play.

MIDI implementation is horribly confusing. Why can't I just have my MIDI keyboard play the track in focus? Arm track and play MIDI notes, simple, but not with Beatmaker 3. Why do I have to go through the hassle of setting up seperate MIDI channels on each track? That means I also have to change MIDI channel on my controller for each track I want to record notes on. Every other DAW I can just arm track and play without hearing other tracks triggered so why can't I do that in Beatmaker 3? Also why can I not hear a sample on pad 1 triggered by MIDI when in Multichannel mode? Seriously, I read through the MIDI info in the manual and I'm like huh? I'm not trying to set up multiple MIDI devices triggering various notes and CCs in some grand orchestration. I mean sure complex options are nice but hell I just want to plug in my MIDI controller and record different instruments, why so complicated?

Also why do I have to quit the app in order to get a new session? The hell I couldn't figure out how to save and quit session and start a new one once the app is already running. Where is the save and new session buttons?

Being a long time DAW user the whole Beatmaker 3 interface should be easy to figure out without even diving into the manual. I should at least be able to record a few tracks intuitively within a couple minutes. I've tried to get into Beatmaker 3 a few times and just end up quitting in frustration. What of the point of being feature rich if you have to jump through all these hoops just to do something simple?

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Comments

  • First you need to understand that that isnt possible to answer because of the options you have in Beatmaker, do you want to play a sample on a pad, do you want to play a plugin on a pad, do you want to play a kit across a bank of pads ?
    Without knowing this, how can anybody help you ?

    If you dont understand the difference between multi channel mode (each pad responds to a different MIDI channel) vs single channel mode (a bank uses one MIDI channel and each pad responds to a different MIDI note) you may be jumping the gun a bit and should just be using omni on for now.

    You can save and create a new session by pressing the browser hamburger button top left, you will see new/save/export on the right at the top.

    Being a long time DAW user means absolutely nothing whatsoever, they dont all work the same way, so why should you understand every DAW because you have used DAWs before.

    Calm down and ask lots of questions (in an easier to read manner) and you will get a lot of help around here, the community is strong, so ask away and dont get stressed.

  • edited February 23

    All new users need to be a little patient and learn to use (and love) Beatmaker's 'complexity' as this is one of it's key strengths.

    Sure, there are a few niggles us experienced users are raising with devs (eg editing automation data) but I can't think of any serious creative software, including industry leaders such as Photoshop, 3D Studio Max, After Effects (and countless others) that don't have similar perceived 'unintuitive' workflows.

    Power and flexibility breeds complexity.

    Stick with it.. you won't regret it!!

    p.s. regarding your midi issue - switch to Omni mode in settings as @5pinlink suggests

  • ouah ! That’s a lot of critics for someone who can’t find the save button...

  • I agree that an external keyboard should only play the track in focus.

  • @anickt said:
    I agree that an external keyboard should only play the track in focus.

    It already can and you set it up that way. I don't understand what the issue is here I guess.

  • In other software I have used the selected track is played by an external keyboard without regard to MIDI channel settings. I don’t see that BM3 does that. Am I missing something?

  • edited February 23

    It’s not the most intuitive, but some of that had to do with the capabilities. Sorry! Also, when you first opened BM3, you should have seen the splash screen shows the options of New Session, Open Session, and QuickStart Guide. I’ll admit that I didn’t look at the QuickStart guide at first, as like you I also like to think I can figure anything out on my own. And by now I’m sure you’re meeting your palm to your face as you realize where the New, Save, and Export buttons are at the top right of the screen when the browser is open - and the browser is opened by default every time you start a new session or even open a previous session from the splash screen. Take a moment to read through the QuickStart guide, watch some of the many BM3 videos on YouTube, and be sure to join in on the Forum Beat Battle! cough cough

  • Your external keyboard may be setup in it's firmware to use all channels available globally assigned to a single channel. If you don't change this behavior, it will always play across the banks using Omni/single-channel/multichannel. You need to reroute your controller to do what you want it to do. Learn MIDI.

  • @mefisme said:
    Your external keyboard may be setup in it's firmware to use all channels available globally assigned to a single channel. If you don't change this behavior, it will always play across the banks using Omni/single-channel/multichannel. You need to reroute your controller to do what you want it to do. Learn MIDI.

    I started out using CV/Gate before there was MIDI. I know how it works.

  • @anickt said:
    I agree that an external keyboard should only play the track in focus.

    on the other hand, a midi keyboard is always set to a midi channel number, whichever it is, so it seems logic that the bank/track you want to play must be on the same channel. I’m not an expert on desktop daws but with Cubasis or Auria, you have to set the input midi channel number (and port of course) so it corresponds to your midi keyboard.
    Midi implementation in BM3 needs to be improved, but I don’t find it confusing or tricky (once you’re familiar with the midi Focus). I use a BeatStep Pro with it and I never had any trouble using it like I usually do.

  • I just restarted BM3 and it is working as I would expect. Strange - possible bug? I don’t care as long as it continues to work this way. I’m just getting back into BM3 after being put off by the buggy first release. I’m loving it now though. Glad this is working for me now.

  • @anickt said:

    @mefisme said:
    Your external keyboard may be setup in it's firmware to use all channels available globally assigned to a single channel. If you don't change this behavior, it will always play across the banks using Omni/single-channel/multichannel. You need to reroute your controller to do what you want it to do. Learn MIDI.

    I started out using CV/Gate before there was MIDI. I know how it works.

    Are you determined to come across as somebody who thinks they know everything, and quite patently does not, CV/Gate has absolute no relation to MIDI what so ever !!!
    One is analogue and based on voltages and pulses, the other is digital and based on messages with a vast amount of information capability beyond voltage range and trigger pulse, this may even be the reason you are so confused, CV/Gate does not support channels.

    While you claim to 'Know' everything everybody points out, you are the one struggling to trigger anything or even save a project, again try some of the suggestions above like "Read the quickstart guide"

  • @5pinlink I think they just meant they were doing music stuff before MIDI existed, to insinuate it’s not new to them, but then restarting BM3 resolved their issue, which is great but understandably frustrating. Also they’re not the person that started this thead, so probably not having the same issues doing things like finding the save button. =)

  • edited February 24

    @5pinlink Sorry sir. I am not the OP. I never claimed to “know everything”. I asked about a certain function and if I was missing something as far as how that function worked. One responder gave me a bunch of advice regarding my MIDI controller firmware and then suggested I “learn MIDI”. My point was that I started out using CV/Gate before there was MIDI and have used both for many years since so I know how it works. I simply wasn’t seeing how something worked and asked what I was missing. The tone of this thread is very hostile. I find that sad. I have also figured out the answer to my own question.

  • Like i said, ask lots of questions and you will get help, act like you know everything and nobody will help, very few questions have actually been asked in this thread.

    As for unintuitive, C++ is a massive unintuitive bunch of nonsense to me, but not to most developers, so is it unintuitive or just complicated beyond my interest level ?

    There is a fine line between unintuitive and just complicated because it has to be, example....
    Plugin is loaded in to the sampler = unintuitive.
    MIDI channels have to be correct = Complicated because it has to be.

    Personally i dont find MIDI set up unintuitive or complicated, yes it could probably be better, but it will always need setting up, there is no magic set my keyboard up genie.

  • It would be cool if your on the timeline and the selected line you are on you can play/audition that sound.

  • The whole point I'm trying to make and I'm not saying anybody doesn't know anything it's just that we don't have Global midi learn so you're going to have to edit your controllers if you want them to work in the way you want and BeatMaker 3

  • edited February 24

    @anickt said:
    @5pinlink Sorry sir. I am not the OP. I never claimed to “know everything”. I asked about a certain function and if I was missing something as far as how that function worked. One responder gave me a bunch of advice regarding my MIDI controller firmware and then suggested I “learn MIDI”. My point was that I started out using CV/Gate before there was MIDI and have used both for many years since so I know how it works. I simply wasn’t seeing how something worked and asked what I was missing. The tone of this thread is very hostile. I find that sad. I have also figured out the answer to my own question.

    I failed to add "Learn MIDI IN Beatmaker 3". I'm so sorry that came off rather rude. That wasn't my intention. Almost all DAWs on iOS platforms have limitations to hardware assignment unlike desktops because Hardware manufacturers are not porting their editors to mobile platforms. II guess they don't believe in it yet.
    The purpose of MIDI learn is to prevent having to remap a controller. Unfortunately, we don't have it yet like we did with Beatmaker 2. It is very complex to implement. May I also note l typed that entire previous post with my voice on my phone. I was driving. Just clarifying. I am not a hostile or any enemy. I promise. :)

  • edited February 24

    And one more thing for all and OP, 3.1 will satisfy all your saving exporting new session loading instead of being buried. So it's coming! ;)

  • @mefisme said:

    @anickt said:
    @5pinlink Sorry sir. I am not the OP. I never claimed to “know everything”. I asked about a certain function and if I was missing something as far as how that function worked. One responder gave me a bunch of advice regarding my MIDI controller firmware and then suggested I “learn MIDI”. My point was that I started out using CV/Gate before there was MIDI and have used both for many years since so I know how it works. I simply wasn’t seeing how something worked and asked what I was missing. The tone of this thread is very hostile. I find that sad. I have also figured out the answer to my own question.

    I failed to add "Learn MIDI IN Beatmaker 3". I'm so sorry that came off rather rude. That wasn't my intention. Almost all DAWs on iOS platforms have limitations to hardware assignment unlike desktops because Hardware manufacturers are not porting their editors to mobile platforms. II guess they don't believe in it yet.
    The purpose of MIDI learn is to prevent having to remap a controller. Unfortunately, we don't have it yet like we did with Beatmaker 2. It is very complex to implement. May I also note l typed that entire previous post with my voice on my phone. I was driving. Just clarifying. I am not a hostile or any enemy. I promise. :)

    Cool! Thanks man

  • edited February 24

    @anickt apoligies for getting you confused with the OP, and yes this thread was hostile the very nano second it was posted, i would suggest that was the OPs point entirely.

  • @5pinlink said:
    @anickt apoligies for getting you confused with the OP, and yes this thread was hostile the very nano second it was posted, i would suggest that was the OPs point entirely.

    No problem. These message boards get crazy sometimes.

  • What BM3 does for its price is nothing short of the Lords work. I can’t imagine what type of life lived leads one with any marginal pro audio experience to bitch about something so obviously generous. I seriously cram to understand.

    Drop $1800 on the new MPC rig and let us know how bug free or intuitive it is. While at it, let us know how responsive Akai is to all of your concerns/issues with MPC software. It’s $300 stand-alone and while great indeed, would die to be BM3 when it grows up. Good luck getting any feedback in the forums.lol

    Meanwhile, BM3.

  • @WillieNegus said:
    What BM3 does for its price is nothing short of the Lords work. I can’t imagine what type of life lived leads one with any marginal pro audio experience to bitch about something so obviously generous. I seriously cram to understand.

    Drop $1800 on the new MPC rig and let us know how bug free or intuitive it is. While at it, let us know how responsive Akai is to all of your concerns/issues with MPC software. It’s $300 stand-alone and while great indeed, would die to be BM3 when it grows up. Good luck getting any feedback in the forums.lol

    Meanwhile, BM3.

    Well said sir. Sticking to the key points. Straight up. :)

  • edited February 26

    @WillieNegus said:
    What BM3 does for its price is nothing short of the Lords work. I can’t imagine what type of life lived leads one with any marginal pro audio experience to bitch about something so obviously generous. I seriously cram to understand.

    Drop $1800 on the new MPC rig and let us know how bug free or intuitive it is. While at it, let us know how responsive Akai is to all of your concerns/issues with MPC software. It’s $300 stand-alone and while great indeed, would die to be BM3 when it grows up. Good luck getting any feedback in the forums.lol

    Meanwhile, BM3.

    Not sure why an IOS developer should be compared to a multinational conglomerate ?

    Just to balance it out, lets compare it to Reaper, now BM3 looks very poor, the features are not good enough, the customer service isnt good enough, releases are too slow etc etc.

    Lets avoid comparisons to other software, some it may look better, but as shown, others it will come up very short.

  • My point wasn’t really to compare BM3 to the other software/workstation as much as I was intending to illustrate its value. May have failed there but even if we compare to Reaper, I don’t see where it comes up short. We’re talking a DAW that fits on a device you can take anywhere and create with that costs a fraction of what Reaper or anything else with comparable features costs. Reaper $225 US for a full license and really isn’t as fun to think about creating with while sitting on the beach in my trunks.

    Also pretty sure if Intua was getting $225 a pop from all of us they’d give us a little more feature and service love.

    Certainly subject to opinion but I stand by my astonishment that anyone with experience in pro audio can feel anything but impressed by what BM3 offers at its cost all things considered.

    I’m positive you agree with me @5pinlink. I’m pretty new around here but you’re one of the main sources of game, workarounds, etc for Bm3. People with as much knowledge don’t spend it on things that aren’t valuable. Never happens.

  • Reaper is $65 and runs on a plethora of handheld windows tablets that cost from £25 upwards, so in terms of overall cost (iPad) is certainly lower than BM3 by a hell of a lot of money, is not built on an expansion eco system (Intua want you to spend way more than $65 or $225, shit, i want you to spend way more than $225 and keep the developers viable, so i can get more updates and bug fixes) so your argument is flawed, and again, i will say, lets judge BM3 on its own merits not some cost biasing based on purchaser remorse.

    Heres another example, MPC Live costs £700 OMG OMG OMG BM3 is much cheaper, what does BM3 sell for second hand ?
    Again cost comparisons are flawed and should never ever be used.

    Beatmaker is getting good, not because of its cost.

  • Put me down for a ‘Lords Work’ Intua T-shirt. BM3 runs on something the size of a comic book, cost me 25 and changed my life. I can honestly say that this app has helped me through some pretty rough times the past seven months. Moreso than any desktop daw could have.

  • Right im done, the word Cost seems to be in every post now, next step from that is “I found this bug” “ Yeah but it only cost xxx” seen this way too many times.

  • Its like if someone gave me a brand new fully functioning (for my needs) car... that even folded up and fit under my desk at work so I didnt have to pay for parking or worry about it getting broke into and it only cost something like $2000. Yah, i would feel compelled to mention the price.... sorry?

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