Kinda fed up with the Ipad etc

Finding it hard to invest the time into the Ipad anymore. My headphone socket seems to have broken after merely a year and half and well there appears to be no DAW capable enough to do what Ableton did over 10 years ago. Making jungle for example just seems a waste of time in BM3 as samples continue drift out of time and do strange things and then real time editing just isn't there. Sorry to put a downer on it but I'm just kinda fed up with it all. Still got love for Intua but reaching the end of my patience. :-(

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Comments

  • Send a video of the drift issue and someone might be able to help or yeah move on. No point in wasting time.

  • Sorry to hear you feel like this @The_Bro - but have to say - it's been the complete opposite for me.

    I find BM3 really delivers more power and flexibility than any of the other DAW options on iOS, and I'm enjoying working with it more than ever.

    It sucks if your headphone socket is really damaged, but I haven't experienced any of the 'drifting' issues you describe - and I know that me, and several others, are really keen to help you diagnose what is causing this issue. All we'd need is (a) a short video, (b) a detailed description of how the track is setup, or (c) a copy of the session with all the samples included.

    Please do help us to help you before you consider quitting.

  • Make sure you get inside the headphone jack with a toothpick or something and get out any lint or dust. That can cause any port to flake.

    And it's kinda sad you're gonna give up on BM3 because of a sample drift issue that as far as I can tell you haven't tried very hard to troubleshoot. The problem is either the sample, something you're doing, or BM3, and it would benefit everyone to know exactly what it is, and if it's a bug then it will get fixed if we can get more details.

  • There is no sample drift in B3, your sample needs editing.

  • @winconway said:
    There is no sample drift in B3, your sample needs editing.

    That's my assumption too, unless proven otherwise ;)

  • edited January 16

    The fact that i posted a full length song from 1967 with a jungle beat on it (snow miser) and that barely drifted even when it changed by 5 bpm in the middle of a bar goes to say that there is no drift unless it is inherent in the sample, you and me both live on Jungle beats @ronji lol.

  • @ronji said:
    Make sure you get inside the headphone jack with a toothpick or something and get out any lint or dust. That can cause any port to flake.

    That has bit me multiple times.

  • I've yet to come accross a real sample drift in BM3 that was not caused by me.

  • @The_Bro said:
    Finding it hard to invest the time into the Ipad anymore. My headphone socket seems to have broken after merely a year and half and well there appears to be no DAW capable enough to do what Ableton did over 10 years ago. Making jungle for example just seems a waste of time in BM3 as samples continue drift out of time and do strange things and then real time editing just isn't there. Sorry to put a downer on it but I'm just kinda fed up with it all. Still got love for Intua but reaching the end of my patience. :-(

    Yo boss what is the sample that has sample drift? I have never heard of ANY daw that causes the drift to take place is it the off sync timing of music played live or recorded, especially tunes from back in the day. Let us know the sample so we can see but assuredly bm3 is not the culprit

    What am gonna do is purchase Auria pro because they have sample warping capabilities which from what I gather is very effective to deal with such as sample drift, then load the processed sample into bm3. Bm3 is the only one from what I see of the major daws on iOS and desktop to not have this don’t know why but it is what it is

    As for the headphone entry, I’d get it fixed but if ur really fed up then maybe going desktop production might be good for you or whatever route you choose

    What is the sample that drifts off??

  • B3 can do earping, it just isnt as simple as placing markers and moving them, you only need time stretch for warping.

  • @winconway said:
    B3 can do earping, it just isnt as simple as placing markers and moving them, you only need time stretch for warping.

    Well bro, if you can expound such a way to stead warping it would be greatly appreciated. Am really not interested in Auria let alone the cost. Aside from the to-be-expected bugs and crashes bm3, it is well enough for my musics

  • @Thumpee said:
    Bm3 is the only one from what I see of the major daws on iOS and desktop to not have this don’t know why but it is what it is

    What other iOS DAW other than Auria Pro has audio warping?

    If you mean audio stretch, then BM3 does have it.

  • edited January 19

    There is some misconception with B3 users about what audio warping actually is.
    It is nothing more than a really elegant UX for current tools.

    Here is how warping works internally at a very basic level...
    Cut a piece of audio in to slices, stretch those individial slices in to place.

    That is all that warp editing/warp markers actually does, it just does it in a visually pleasing way by dropping markers and allowing you to use those markers to stretch the audio.

    Behind that elegant UX is just audio slices stretched.
    When you drop two markers (minimum needed for a warp) you create a start and end point for a warp, so to the computer, you just created an entirely new audio clip, then you stretch it, you keep doing that, viola, warping.
    The elegant UX just hides away the fact that the computer is slicing and stretching.

    Like i said, B3 has all the tools for warp editing, it just isnt as easy as drop markers and move them.

    That does not mean we dont need a good warp marker set up, we do, but it still is fact, warp markers are a clever UX design of the current slicer and timestretch added to the timeline.

    Now taking all of that on board.
    1 load sample in to sampler.
    2 Cut in to slices.
    3 Save to pads or to storage.
    4 Turn on stretch for each slice and manually size them (this obviously much quicker if each slices starts at grid) be it in the sampler or on the grid.
    5 Change tempo etc and slices stay locked in place :)

    What exactly are you trying to do ?
    I may have some insight.

  • edited January 19

    Thanks for mythbusting, Win. :)

    Everything I need to do with my loops I can already do in Beatmaker - even if that sometimes involves a little surgery and mathematics. All that warp markers would add is speed and simplicity to this process.

    I understand why people like it. It lets you easily hack the timing and groove of a loop without having to think about what is going on in the background. For example, dragging the snare "left a bit, or right a bit".

  • @winconway said:

    That was good thanks. I have a song from the sixties an old rhythm and blues track. After loading into sampler and playing back it ‘drifts’ out of time because when I Turn on the metronome you can hear that their is a misalignment between the metronome and piece of audio which begins to be heard after let’s say the third measure. Such has happened before but give or take a few seconds In any given sample based pattern or scene 😬.

    This occurrence leads to the some-loved artifact of hip hop sampling, of there being few to many milliseconds gap of NO AUDIO before the next triggered piece of audio is played. Now the gap of audio happens IF the sampling technique used is so that the triggering is done exactly upon the beginning of a beat or bar and in my case the intent being that the length of audio is full within beat or bar without gap as opposed to the more commonly used technique of the triggering of the next chop before the previous one gets a chance to stop. This latter technique is very organic and leads to some really proper melodies but I think @The_Bro like myself would also like a non drifting sample and if it happens, a way to correct it like you outlined, rathering to chop a sample and being able to trigger them evenly across several pads in its entirety.
    
    So the goal for me is to eliminate the gap artifact by repositioning a sample chop as you suggested in your example. I guess in a nutshell instruments whether all or some of a song not quantized can create the out of timing. Looks like one wouldn’t need warp nor BM Having it as a feature. Gonna check this into my workflow
    
  • edited January 19

    @tk32 said:
    Thanks for mythbusting, Win. :)

    Everything I need to do with my loops I can already do in Beatmaker - even if that sometimes involves a little surgery and mathematics. All that warp markers would add is speed and simplicity to this process.

    I understand why people like it. It lets you easily hack the timing and groove of a loop without having to think about what is going on in the background. For example, dragging the snare "left a bit, or right a bit".

    To be honest, warp markers are amazing, but if somebody used it to shift a snare i would be snickering at them, slice and move or slip edit, anything transient dependant like drums, dont move with warping, you are saving time to make more effort trying to fix the poor definition of your transient later in the mix.
    Honestly, I want slip edit way more than i want warp edit, when you have both and do a lot of editing, you realise that slip is generally superior in most circumstances.

    @Thumpee said:

    @winconway said:


    That was good thanks. I have a song from the sixties an old rhythm and blues track. After loading into sampler and playing back it ‘drifts’ out of time because when I Turn on the metronome you can hear that their is a misalignment between the metronome and piece of audio which begins to be heard after let’s say the third measure. Such has happened before but give or take a few seconds In any given sample based pattern or scene 😬.

    This occurrence leads to the some-loved artifact of hip hop sampling, of there being few to many milliseconds gap of NO AUDIO before the next triggered piece of audio is played. Now the gap of audio happens IF the sampling technique used is so that the triggering is done exactly upon the beginning of a beat or bar and in my case the intent being that the length of audio is full within beat or bar without gap as opposed to the more commonly used technique of the triggering of the next chop before the previous one gets a chance to stop. This latter technique is very organic and leads to some really proper melodies but I think @The_Bro like myself would also like a non drifting sample and if it happens, a way to correct it like you outlined, rathering to chop a sample and being able to trigger them evenly across several pads in its entirety.

    So the goal for me is to eliminate the gap artifact by repositioning a sample chop as you suggested in your example. I guess in a nutshell instruments whether all or some of a song not quantized can create the out of timing. Looks like one wouldn’t need warp nor BM Having it as a feature. Gonna check this into my workflow

    Yeah if you have a sample like that, cut it to measures, use calculate tempo, turn on timestretch, bam its locked, if you create a pattern when you saved slices to pads too, it will all be sequenced and playing back too :)

  • @winconway

    Thanks, really helps alot

  • @number37 said:

    @Thumpee said:

    S> > Bm3 is the only one from what I see of the major daws on iOS and desktop to not have this don’t know why but it is what it is

    What other iOS DAW other than Auria Pro has audio warping?

    If you mean audio stretch, then BM3 does have it.

    Cubasis from steinberg

  • Cubasis doesn't have audio warping as far as i am aware, maybe i missed the update though.

  • edited January 19

    It doesn't have warp markers. It has time stretch. Their marketing has managed to confuse everyone to a point where nobody understands what the difference between warp markers and time stretch is (even though internally it's all the same engine, Elastique or whatever it's called).

  • Elastique is just a type of time stretch algorithm, in Reaper you can use a bunch of various types of algorithms for warping for example.
    Elastique is just very popular on IOS.

  • edited January 19

    Well Elastique isn’t just an algorithm, I’m sure ableton, soundforge, reaper etc would prefer to have their own in-house algorithm rather than having to pay a third party. Obviously it isn’t easy to create such an algorithms.

  • @blueveek said:
    It doesn't have warp markers. It has time stretch. Their marketing has managed to confuse everyone to a point where nobody understands what the difference between warp markers and time stretch is (even though internally it's all the same engine, Elastique or whatever it's called).

    I was checking them out earlier last year and their App Store page said they had warping but I wouldn’t know officially

  • edited January 19

    @theinvisibleman said:
    Well Elastique isn’t just an algorithm, I’m sure ableton, soundforge, reaper etc would prefer to have their own in-house algorithm rather than having to pay a third party. Obviously it isn’t easy to create such an algorithms.

    Elastique is just an algorithm, it is an algorithm (multiple algorithms actually, Beatmaker is not the high end Elastique Pro) for timestretching you Licence and implement in your software, Reaper does have its own in house algorithms and other 3rd party algorithms beside Elastique, so does the last version of Sound Forge that i bought, 11 pro i think.

  • edited January 19

    @winconway said:

    @theinvisibleman said:
    Well Elastique isn’t just an algorithm, I’m sure ableton, soundforge, reaper etc would prefer to have their own in-house algorithm rather than having to pay a third party. Obviously it isn’t easy to create such an algorithms.

    Elastique is just an algorithm, it is an algorithm (multiple algorithms actually, Beatmaker is not the high end Elastique Pro) for timestretching you Licence and implement in your software, Reaper does have its own in house algorithms and other 3rd party algorithms beside Elastique, so does the last version of Sound Forge that i bought, 11 pro i think.

    Just saying it’s the most important algorithm out there. Lol😂

  • edited January 20

    Its not really, it is just the easiest and possibly cheapest to implement, there are vastly superior algorithms, some of them even free or just white papers.

    The problem is that timestretch can be done in a myriad of ways and some sound better on certain material vs others, some sound absolutely horrible but defined genres (Akais windowing, Jungle) so personally i would like to see a few implementations, how likely that is i have no idea.

    I really wish IAP for features was on the table for B3.

  • @winconway i think we may have discussed this back in the day, but how does bm3’s algos compare to the others out there?

  • @winconway said:
    Its not really, it is just the easiest and possibly cheapest to implement, there are vastly superior algorithms, some of them even free or just white papers.

    The problem is that timestretch can be done in a myriad of ways and some sound better on certain material vs others, some sound absolutely horrible but defined genres (Akais windowing, Jungle) so personally i would like to see a few implementations, how likely that is i have no idea.

    I really wish IAP for features was on the table for B3.

    What you are saying does not make too much sense. You should ask BM3 developer on why he uses Elastique to give a better answer. Also you have time to reply to this post yet you can’t delete my BM3 account like I requested? Is there someone else I can ask to remove my account?

  • Come on now guys.

    Surely we can have a lively debate about Elastique (etc.) without anyone feeling they want to leave the forum.

  • edited January 20

    @theinvisibleman said:

    @winconway said:
    Its not really, it is just the easiest and possibly cheapest to implement, there are vastly superior algorithms, some of them even free or just white papers.

    The problem is that timestretch can be done in a myriad of ways and some sound better on certain material vs others, some sound absolutely horrible but defined genres (Akais windowing, Jungle) so personally i would like to see a few implementations, how likely that is i have no idea.

    I really wish IAP for features was on the table for B3.

    What you are saying does not make too much sense. You should ask BM3 developer on why he uses Elastique to give a better answer. Also you have time to reply to this post yet you can’t delete my BM3 account like I requested? Is there someone else I can ask to remove my account?

    Yes, please contact admin, i still dont have time, however please dont say i made no sense when i typed verifiable facts, you are being silly for no reason.

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