MIDI Tools Curve crazy issue ....

Hi - I'm having an issue with MIDI Tools Curve, and I hope someone can help. If I'm lucky, it's user error.

Here's the problem:

  • I'm running AUM on an iPad
  • I've got a controller keyboard connected by 5-pin MIDI into my audio interface, transmitting on Channel 1 into the iPad by USB
  • In the iPad, the MIDI is routed first to MIDI Tools Curve which applies a velocity curve. It works perfectly, and I love it. It solves a weak velocity issue with that particular keyboard.
  • However, Curve is also randomly outputting additional MIDI messages.
  • To prove it, I've got two instances of the MIDI Tools Monitor plug-in. The first is listening to incoming MIDI to the iPad from my controller via interface, pre-Curve. The second is listening to the output of Curve itself. In other words, I've isolated the Curve plug-in.
  • Messages originating in Curve include "Note on: 255" and "Note on/off: 255" with a bunch of Aftertouch messages in-between.
  • These messages are wreaking havoc on my AU synths. The disturbance affects each synth differently, none of it desirable. Awful noise, changes in pitch, etc. It renders Curve unusable.

    I sent a support request to @blueveek as well, but I've read that he's a busy guy who's overwhelmed by messages.

I haven't tried Curve in BM3 yet. I'm posting to this forum because I MIDI Tools came by recommendation from a forum member ( @StudioES -- thank you, btw... it's a great plug-in as soon as I fix this issue... )

Does this problem sound familiar to anyone? Any advice?

Pete

Comments

  • Hi @pete12000 Which MIDI controller & interface are you using?
    Please upload a screenshot of the captured MIDI data. And Curve's settings.
    In the meantime, first disable aftertouch on your controller (or filter it out) & test again.

    I tested using KB-1 & AUM's built-in keyboard & nothing stood out.

  • Hi @StudioES - I'm using a DX7S as controller and a Steinberg UR44 interface. Here's a short vid of the issue that I sent to the developer:

    How can I filter out aftertouch?

    Pete

  • Ah, the old Yamahas and their infuriating active sensing messages & other completely unnecessary MIDI data it always outputs, even when you aren't playing it. Sorry, Yamaha doesn't pay me anymore so I'm reluctant to troubleshoot their products. And those appear to be status bytes, not actual notes or AT messages, so it looks like Monitor is getting confused by all the garbage the Yamaha is sending.

    @pete12000 said:
    How can I filter out aftertouch?

    Use Midi Tools MID Clone & Filter. Disable both types of AT. And as for all of the unnecessary MIDI data the old Yamahas send, try disabling System Messages & cross your fingers. Please let me know the results.

  • Ok, thanks... I set up Clone & Filter exactly as you described. I've got my MIDI all on Channel 1 with this flow: DX7S->SteinbergUR44->USB/iPad->Clone&Filter->Curve->Zeeon (also, Curve-> my electric piano app)

    Monitor is still showing the same weird ON/OFF messages now originating in the Clone & Filter instance. Zeeon is still screeching uncontrollably as soon as it happens. Also the EP app de-tunes, which is weird.

    These issues (screeching, detuning, etc.) do not occur when I control the plug-ins directly with the DX7S. The DX7S works perfectly. The only problem is the velocity.... which is where I started.

    Why would the MIDI Tools plug-ins have an issue when other plug-ins do not?

    Is there anything else that can be done?

    Thanks again for helping... I hope I can salvage it...

    Pete

  • Do you have the Pad that Zeeon is on in KEYS MODE & all the MIDI processors on the entire Bank, or just the Pad? These Midi Tools plugins seem to only work in KEYS MODE.
    I don't have an external MIDI controller with me (in a hotel currently).
    @mefisme can you help here?

  • Another thing - during testing, the Midi Tools dev said that the plugins pass all MIDI data, filtering nothing. And synths like Zeeon, etc. never listen to all MIDI data. If you're have a Windows PC, try to filter & capture MIDI using MIDI OX. Kenton makes a box specifically for those old Yamahas too.

    I'm interested to see if Midi Tools is broken, & will further test an MPE app (KB-1).

  • I think Keys Mode refers to BM3? I haven't tried MIDI Tools in BM3 yet... I'm just in AUM so far.

    I don't have a Windows PC... I'll see if I can find an app on MacOS.

  • edited November 17

    ...but again, Zeeon has no problems listening to my DX7S directly. It's after I put MIDI Tools in the chain when everything goes haywire.

  • I'll attempt to confirm this Midi Tools bug in 2 hours during halftime. In AUM, with a 2nd iPad as a Bluetooth MIDI Controller, using synths w/o long-standing MIDI issues like BeepStreet Zeeon & Sunrizer. Ripplemaker & KQ Dixie. Will post results. Thanks.

  • @StudioES said:
    I'll attempt to confirm this Midi Tools bug in 2 hours during halftime. In AUM, with a 2nd iPad as a Bluetooth MIDI Controller, using synths w/o long-standing MIDI issues like BeepStreet Zeeon & Sunrizer. Ripplemaker & KQ Dixie. Will post results. Thanks.

    That's awesome - thank you!

  • edited November 17

    Pete, I couldn't reproduce this issue with Midi Tools in AUM.
    My suggestion is to try a different MIDI controller. Or get the Kenton box made specifically for those old troublesome Yamahas. I don't know anything about the UR44, but I cut my teeth on Yamaha.
    My (zipped) AUM Session is attached. Just replace 'Mike's iPad Bluetooth' with your UR44/DX7S.

  • Hey @StudioES - thanks for taking the time. It's too bad that I'm still in the woods. I'll load up that session tonight and give it a try... maybe it will reveal a mistake in my set-up.

    Thanks again,

    Pete

  • Pete, I re-watched your video. Those are definitely the troublesome Yamaha System Messages that I mentioned earlier. And Midi Tools can't handle them, just like many DAWs couldn't handle the old Yamaha keyboards years ago. Hopefully you filtered-out System Messages in MIDI Clone & Filter first. If you're attached to the DX7S, I know the Kenton box will. Maybe the UR44 has a way to disable them? Or blueveek adds Yamaha-specific filtering (if filtering System Messages in MIDI Clone & Filter doesn't do it.)

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